Social aspects forum: Going out to dinner the old-fashioned way
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| Today a friend and I went antiquing in Sonoma and stayed to eat dinner at an Irish pub with outdoor tables. What an amazing time we had! There was an ashtray on every table, most of the patrons were smoking, and no one cast any disparaging looks our way. I had forgotten how wonderful it is not to have to rush through a meal so that I can walk the requisite number of feet away from the business entrance to have a cigarette. We stayed there for hours, even smoking between courses, just like in the good old days. The best thing was that the outdoor eating area was not in an enclosed courtyard, hidden away from the rest of the world. It was right in front of the pub. Pedestrians were walking by constantly, and not one of them did that phony cough. I don't know why Sonoma's laws would be so relaxed in comparison with the laws in other cities and towns in Sonoma County, but I suspect it has something to do with its status as one of the California cities with an old Spanish mission. They get lots of tourists, including tourists from abroad, and that creates a more cosmopolitan atmosphere and also creates the incentive not to annoy tourists who might not have to deal with the same draconian anti-smoking laws at home. |
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| That sounds so nice and relaxing. I miss being able to relax in a restaurant---especially being able to smoke between courses. It's nice to know that there are still nice places where smokers can go to enjoy a meal. Did they have Irish beers/drinks and Irish food too? |
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| Yes, they did, Val. I had some great shepherd's pie, but because its wine country, I also had a green salad with Champagne vinaigrette dressing. |
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| Oh, That sounds so nice Zuzu. I didn't think there was anywhere left in the states where you could still smoke in a public place? Glad to hear there is. My DH is from Sonoma, though he moved up here when he was a teen. We met within months of his move here. |
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| It was really, really nice, Joy. The amazing thing was that everyone there was smoking. I don't know whether it means that a high percentage of people still smoke when they aren't forced to hide or that all of the smokers in the vicinity converge on that street in Sonoma. We could see the outdoor eating areas of two or three restaurants from where we were sitting, and there were people smoking at every table. But do you really think our Western states are the norm now? What about the tobacco-growing states? Are they like the other states now? When the anti-smoking laws were getting started here, a news item underscored the difference by reporting that it was against the law to post a "no smoking" sign in a public place in one of those states. I can't remember exactly which one, but it might have been North Carolina. |
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| Oh, I don't know? I guess I just assumed it was the same everywhere? Maybe not huh? |
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| According to Wiki (not always a good source), there were several states in 2009 that had not enacted a smoking ban. I don't know if that's changed by now. Those states were Alaska, Wyoming, Oklahoma, Texas, Missouri, Mississippi, Alabama, Indiana, Kentucky, West Virginia, Virginia, and South Carolina. But it says that there have been cities and counties in those states that enacted bans. Hopefully, people from those states will post to let us know how things are in their state. The article also said that Oklahoma prohibits local governments from passing smoking laws. I found that interesting. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_smoking_bans |
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| i just think the whole thing is going to inspire a movement similar to the speakeasy days. People can still smoke in private residences, so what if they drop a few bucks as a gift to the host. Heck, the host might cook up some food...whatever they like; maybe serve some wine, beer, mixed drinks to their friends, get to know new people. Whatdya think? Maybe I'll build on a greatroom with a fireplace and a door out to the patio. Wanna' come? Woman on the eastbound train ...........................................Je Suis Désolé. (also a mule lovin', Charley huggin' girl) |
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| What's the password? Do you have one of those sliding panels at the door so you can check out who the guests are? What are all these states that have the prohibition against smoking going to recoup the revenue they lose on cigarette taxes?? Oh, I know....from You and Me. It's best to remain silent and be thought a fool than to open your mouth and remove all doubt. |
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| For years there was a club (called the Barber's Closest) in the basement of the old Washington Hotel in Madision (on Washington) near capital square and right across from the old railroad station). The whole thing was fronted by a little (empty) barbershop that had antique barber's chairs, mirrors, wall cabinets. Those who ventured in, might notice that one of the tall cabinets had a leather razor sharpener strap hanging on the side. If you knew to pull it the cabinet opened to a narrow staircase with a burled brass rail leading down through velvet curtains to several rooms filled with antique parlor sets, coffee tables (with ashtrays), fireplaces, brass coat trees, plants, ceiling fans, fringed lamps; all in victorian decor. A trip beyond through a hallway (where restrooms stood behind antique doors) would lead to a lovely antique bar with old leather stools, mirrors and brass rails. They served wonderful frozen drinks and old-timey cocktails, hors d'oeuvres, and a large selection fo beers. You had to know where that strap was though or you ended up gawking at the barber shop and passing it by. Woman on the eastbound train ...........................................Je Suis Désolé. (also a mule lovin', Charley huggin' girl) |
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| How wonderful that sounds! I'd love to go to a place like that. |
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| It really was nice. In the daylight one would see that it had several of those metal access doors up to the street because they would open it all up for cleaning, airing, and restocking. In the evening it was the perfect place to settle in with friends for conversation and relaxation. The Washington hotel was interesting too because it was built next to the railroad station near the end of the 19th century. In spite of beautiful 'bones', over years as the railroad changed from passengers to freight and modern hotels popped up, it had become delapitated and fallen to being a sort of cheap boarding house mostly for men. In about the mid 60's the whole place was refurbished by new owners. Parts became studio apartments and it housed several other businesses: a regular bar on the main floor (Club de Wash) that was small but allowed dancing, several boutiques and collectables shops, and a high end restaurant upstairs. That was called the Cafe' Palms and had a very eclectic, airy feeling and wonderful fresh cuisine. One took the old original cage elevator up. We were college students at the time so it was a real treat to afford to eat at Cafe' Palms and relax afterward in the Barber's closet all in one evening. With some changes, the hotel was still in operation when I moved from Madison in '87; I visited a couple of times after that, so I was sad when a fire ruined that lovely building in 1996. Woman on the eastbound train ...........................................Je Suis Désolé. (also a mule lovin', Charley huggin' girl) |
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| I loved living in Madison in 1946-7, my dad was going to law school. Decided he didn't like it, and we moved back up north to Superior, where he got his teaching degree at what is now UWSuperior. We lived right on one of the lakes, what a place for a 12 year old to explore. Still like to go there and see what's new. We could go there for lunch sometime, Jamie!! It's best to remain silent and be thought a fool than to open your mouth and remove all doubt. |
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| I wish I could. Can't leave INX that long though. My fault but the longest he's ever been away from me is 4 hours. Typically, if I can't include him I just don't leave except to run errands and even then if it gets too long, I will break to stop home in between. It started because I went down to MO that first november to get him and he was very scared and timid. When I got him home and cut his hair, he had apparent scars all over. He'd been abused and it took him a long time to trust; winter came early that year so (more by accident than plan) we were together all the time. He flanks me always now and, while he enjoys listening when people come over or we visit, is still very timid with others. I never meant to spoil him but he does suffer separation anxiety so I'm reluctant to leave him with others or for long periods. I have thought about trying that doggie day care facility near East Troy....but i'm not sure I wouldn't suffer separation anxiety myself now. On one hand, I'm still hoping to steal a couple of hours to get to the state fair, on the other, if I do, I will gauge time away accordingly. Yep, Madison was wonderful. with the exception of taking a year away to travel, I lived there from 1971 thru '87. moved back only because my dad needed care and always intended to go back. Life just got increasingly encumbered here and Madison has changed so that it doesn't feel like home so much anymore. Which lake did you live on? We spent so much time on them. I was nearly an expert water-skier back in the day.....still have my best slalom ski in the basement rafters.....wonder if i could even pick my butt out of the water now.  Woman on the eastbound train ...........................................Je Suis Désolé. (also a mule lovin', Charley huggin' girl) |
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| Wild guess, I think it was Lake Monona. The closest grade school was just blocks away. You know, I don't even remember the name of the school I went to. I attended a dozen different schools before I got to high school, so much of it is a happy blur/ It's best to remain silent and be thought a fool than to open your mouth and remove all doubt. |
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hummm.....perhaps you inhaled while in Madison  Woman on the eastbound train ...........................................Je Suis Désolé. (also a mule lovin', Charley huggin' girl) |
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| Really though, of things of regret: in about '75 when I never expected I could actually own a house a'tal, we attended a 'moving to CA' party for some friends. The woman had been renting in a huge stately stone Mansion on Monona where we had not visited before. It had been divided into several apartments but still had marble entries, tall leaded windows, porcelain tiled floors, wrought iron bannisters and the like. 3 stories plus attic if I recall. I found out at the party that it was for sale. I could have gone to grandma for a payment down but ex-DH said "ridiculous"...they wanted $119K. ONLY...119....hugh stone mansion on the capital side of Monona...need I say more?  Woman on the eastbound train ...........................................Je Suis Désolé. (also a mule lovin', Charley huggin' girl) |
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| Ohhhh, that reminds me of a house that DH and I looked at in 82, beautiful old victorian that NOTHING had been done to that would have marred the woodwork, etc. Sale price $90K. Ha. Interest rates were 18% and even if we had been able to get a loan, there would have been nothing left for food, heat, etc.! It was a lovely house, leaded glass here and there, hardwood floors even in the attic, huge master bath with a 2' X 3' marble slab under the commode, open staircase to the upper. Peeling paint outside, and a basement full of tools and canned goods, and empty jars. What a gem. I had $20K to put down, but at those rates, whew. And we weren't married yet, and he didn't have a credit history so it was a lost cause. oh well. It's best to remain silent and be thought a fool than to open your mouth and remove all doubt. |
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| see now..we both could have had smokin' speakeasys!....that stone mansion is probably worth over a $mil+ by now...location, location, location. Hate the husband's insecurity for trying to tie my hands at every turn (he even downplayed my graduation after I worked full time and pulled a grade point receiving dean's honors from the school of business); he said graduation was no big deal and we had camping planned that weekend (so we went camping). My own fault of course. Whew!!!...when Zuzu gets back she's likely to kick us off of this thread...it is not called "The b*tch 'bout men and opportunities forsaken forum"...eeeeyy matey? Woman on the eastbound train ...........................................Je Suis Désolé. (also a mule lovin', Charley huggin' girl) |
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| Never happen! I'm so ready to bitch about men and about opportunities forsaken. Someone should start a separate cubit for that, but I'm glad to host the rants in its absence. In the early 1970s, for example, I was visiting some friends in Dutch Flat, a town in California's Gold Country. The Motherlode-era hotel was for sale, along with most of the original furniture -- ornately carved beds (I always suspected it might originally have been the local whorehouse) and gorgeous painted porcelain washstands -- for $18,500.00! I had to pass it up because I couldn't scrape together that much cash in those years, and it was impossible to get a mortgage loan without fire insurance. No one would insure the buildings up there, in spite of the fact that they had already been standing there for more than 100 years without mishap. The reason I couldn't have scraped up the cash was that I had just divorced a homicidal alcoholic maniac and had given up my house, my car, and my bank accounts in exchange for the privilege of staying alive. Am I ready to bitch? You bet I am!!!! |
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