Mid Atlantic Magpie Chatter forum: What's Going on in the World Today and Yesterday #2~ July/August 2011

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luvsgrtdanes
Jul 29, 2011 1:35 PM CST
Name: Ronnie
Southeastern PA~Zone 6
I Love MAM~So Happy Together
We came from here http://cubits.org/MidAtlanticMusings/thread/view/60777/#new_...

What do you see and hear of interest? This is the place for conversation about past, present and future that influences our lives in some way.

We are not looking to engage in a lot of intense debates here especially of a political/religious nature but will certainly be tolerant of all points of view.

Thumb of 2011-07-29/luvsgrtdanes/2e1685
It happens in a flash, but the memory of it last forever. It can not be borrowed or stolen, and it is of no earthly good until it is given away. So if in your hurry you meet someone who is too weary to smile, leave him one of yours, for no one needs a smile quite as much as he who has none to give...

Imagestormyla
Jul 29, 2011 1:48 PM CST
Name: Stormy
Valley Forge Pa
I Love MAM ~ So Happy Together
Well, here is a truly remarkable bit of lesser known American history having to do with our World War I veterans and the debt that was owed to them by our Government.

I never heard this story in relation to Generals MacArthur and Patton. It's pretty hard to believe that so many men served under them after this incident which happened long before WWII.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bonus_Army
Imagesallyg
Jul 29, 2011 2:49 PM CST
Name: Sally
central Maryland
slef employed writier
wait, I'm still formulating thoughts on the school and work thing.... Big Grin
Those kids must have had some significant issues to need all that discussion at that age. Doesn't sound like the school was wll equipped or staffed enough to handle it. Aren't they expected to be professional educators- why do paretns have to do so much? I think sometimes the district can be found inadequate, and they will pay tuition at a school that is suitable.

Now I'll se the latest link.


BTW, flooding in South Korea Sad always think of our wonderful pediatrician whose mom still lives there.
When my oldest got to teens, one meeting was pretty special. In the gentle context of, don't take your good life for granted. Our doc told us that his family had lived in Inchon before the Korean war. Dad owned a factory. They lost everything, including the three sisters of he and his two brothers, that due to lack of medical care. How sad !!!!!! So Dad insisted the boys go into medicine. Imagine being wiped out yet striving for the education, learning another language (the chances of me mastering Korean are Slim and None!) for your further degree... Just have to admire that. Now his own kids have great college degrees, DD had a Fulbright scholaship, and struggling to find jobs on their level of qualitfication.
"If you bring joy and enthusiasm to everything you do, people will think you're crazy" W. Haelfeli, New Yorker cartoon
Imagestormyla
Jul 29, 2011 3:36 PM CST
Name: Stormy
Valley Forge Pa
I Love MAM ~ So Happy Together

People who come here from other countries are very appreciative of the opportunities here. They have no problem with seizing the day and making the most of what we have to offer. Some very westernized former citizens of India and I often speak of how little Americans are thankful of what we have. They always say that our public has absolutely no idea of how bad things really are for people in other parts of the world.

The only reason they even have such discussions with me is because they know that I have seen true life in India. Imagine a country where you can't drink the water and if you even shower in it, you'll get all sorts of parasites.
Imagestormyla
Jul 29, 2011 3:48 PM CST
Name: Stormy
Valley Forge Pa
I Love MAM ~ So Happy Together
Sally, I often spent time around this girl's kids. They were almost always well behaved and they were easy to relate with. One was very smart. The other was slower, but interested in most things. From what she used to tell me about the calls and the programs that they kept getting enrolled in and sent to, I kept expecting to hear that they were next in line for the firing squad.

It was total overkill. It seemed that once they got into some type of "special" program, then the system took over and she was powerless to control it. She moved and changed schools once and once the new school got the records, she said the stuff started all over again at the new school. I lost touch with her after that and never heard whether or not there was any improvement.

My thoughts were exactly the same as yours. The teachers/counselors should have been a lot better equipped to deal with whatever the issues were and should not have been bothering her so much. It was really unbelievable. I thought that she was a very good mother from all of the times that I observed her interactions and what I knew of her efforts.

Imagesallyg
Jul 29, 2011 4:57 PM CST
Name: Sally
central Maryland
slef employed writier
Being very smart is as much trouble to many teachers as being unable to absorb the info. Staying ahead of the smart ones is hard.

Interesting piece of history about the Bonus March.
"If you bring joy and enthusiasm to everything you do, people will think you're crazy" W. Haelfeli, New Yorker cartoon
Imagesheryl
Jul 29, 2011 5:07 PM CST
Name: Sheryl
Middle Tennessee, 6b
Bitbit your "but the idea of going to jail for a crime I didn't commit is terrifying to me. " is one I heartily subscribe to. Of all the systems that run in our country, I think the legal system is one of the least just, clear sighted or well run. Scares the carp out of me.
Imagebitbit
Jul 29, 2011 6:22 PM CST
Name: bit
Eastern VA and NC
Zone 7b/8a
I'm sure it was a typo, but I'm Rolling on the floor laughing at the image of you being so scared you lose your CARP!
Imagestormyla
Jul 29, 2011 7:05 PM CST
Name: Stormy
Valley Forge Pa
I Love MAM ~ So Happy Together
Hilarious! Hilarious! It's no typo Bit. That's a code word for the other one.

I've always been afraid that I would be selected for jury duty because I am afraid that I would get involved in one of those cases where the person really was innocent but everything conspired to make them look guilty. I really don't know except for cases where the person was caught red handed if I could vote guilty for someone.

That fear of unjustly condemning someone would haunt me forever.
Imagebitbit
Jul 29, 2011 7:20 PM CST
Name: bit
Eastern VA and NC
Zone 7b/8a
OK, but I'm sticking with my mental image of scared Sheryl throwing a fish!

Yeah, I was up for jury duty earlier this year, and thought a lot about how terrifying it would be to make that kind of decision. Luckily, I wasn't called up, so I didn't have to.
luvsgrtdanes
Jul 29, 2011 7:24 PM CST
Name: Ronnie
Southeastern PA~Zone 6
I Love MAM~So Happy Together
I feel the same way Stormy, I'll admit I'm not a good candidate for jury duty. I don't want someones fate in my hands Blinking
Lou was actually on a case just like that once, all the evidence pointed to this guy and it truly wasn't him. They found the actual person after the case was closed, they did find him innocent but he said it was hard.

I'm proof positive here on two counts that our legal system really stinks. Just because it's allowable by law doesn't make it right.
It happens in a flash, but the memory of it last forever. It can not be borrowed or stolen, and it is of no earthly good until it is given away. So if in your hurry you meet someone who is too weary to smile, leave him one of yours, for no one needs a smile quite as much as he who has none to give...

Imagestormyla
Jul 29, 2011 7:43 PM CST
Name: Stormy
Valley Forge Pa
I Love MAM ~ So Happy Together
Yep, I feel the same way Ronnie. When I tell people that, they say that is all the more reason that I should serve.

They say that since the burden of proof is on the prosecution to prove the person guilty beyond a reasonable doubt, the jury should be full of completely skeptical people. Being fully aware of how easy it is to create a very convincing argument buy omitting one tiny bit of information that could skew that whole scenario, I have complete unease about serving.

I have been called several times, but luckily was never chosen.
Imagestormyla
Jul 29, 2011 8:02 PM CST
Name: Stormy
Valley Forge Pa
I Love MAM ~ So Happy Together
What did everyone think about the guy accused of statutory rape being on the sex offenders list?
Imagesallyg
Jul 29, 2011 9:49 PM CST
Name: Sally
central Maryland
slef employed writier
A case like that deserves an individual judgement to remove him from the list. OK technically it was underage, but if he went and married same girl then thats a committed now legal realtionship. I don't want my offenders list clogged with him. There are plenty of sickos to go around.
"If you bring joy and enthusiasm to everything you do, people will think you're crazy" W. Haelfeli, New Yorker cartoon
Imagestormyla
Jul 29, 2011 11:08 PM CST
Name: Stormy
Valley Forge Pa
I Love MAM ~ So Happy Together
Do you all think that all statutory rape offenders should automatically be included on that list? What about cases between consenting teens? Do they also put teenage girls on that list?
Imagezuzu
Jul 30, 2011 3:56 PM CST
Name: Zuzu
Northern California
zone 9
Not automatically included, but not automatically excluded either. In many people's minds, a charge of statutory rape implies that the victim consented, but it's often a case of full-blown rape that's been knocked down to statutory as a result of plea bargaining or of judicial bias against the victim.
Imagesallyg
Jul 30, 2011 9:17 PM CST
Name: Sally
central Maryland
slef employed writier
Never thought about it buit am shocked at the number that are on the list
"If you bring joy and enthusiasm to everything you do, people will think you're crazy" W. Haelfeli, New Yorker cartoon
Imagestormyla
Jul 31, 2011 8:56 AM CST
Name: Stormy
Valley Forge Pa
I Love MAM ~ So Happy Together
Yes, ZuZu I have to agree that a case by case basis decided by either the jury or the judge would be better. The list is an important safeguard for children, but also should not be an overly punitive weapon against a teen's indiscretion, particularly among consenting teens.

I seriously doubt whether any 18 year olds who are thinking of having sex with a 16 year old stop and think about the lifelong effects of having their names on a sex offender's list. So many kids lie about their age too when they are in the dating game. It seems like their parents should all be telling them to ask for the other person's ID to verify their age right when they start dating.

This situation made me stop and think about the kids in my crowd when I was a teen. One of the gals was going steady with a boy who was 2 or 3 years younger. They went together for about 3 years, so I know that she was 18 when he was 15 or 16 and they eventually became sexually active. They broke up when she was 18 or 19.

Funny thing was about 4 years later she married his older brother who was a year older than her. A couple of the other gals in our crowd dated the younger brother after they broke up. He was very much a part of our crowd and we all adored him. He was so cute and charming. It never crossed any of our minds that being involved with him could cause us a legal problem. If it were today, they all could have ended up on the sex offender's list. Blinking

Imagestormyla
Jul 31, 2011 9:59 AM CST
Name: Stormy
Valley Forge Pa
I Love MAM ~ So Happy Together
Here's a story about a local, but large scale crime of elephant ivory poaching that caught my eye. I thought that elephant poaching was a thing of the past. But after reading this story, I did some surfing and found that there has been a big resurgence in it these past 5 years.

I really thought that only older ivory items were only being traded in the antique markets. But it seems now the crooks are having the finished pieces treated to look like older pieces. This news is very disturbing.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/43901762/ns/us_news-environment/...

I wonder if you are committing a crime by buying one of these pieces? I have some older pieces that my Great Uncle brought back from Africa and China in the 1920's when he was in the Merchant Marines. It seems like prosecuting the customers as well as the dealers would be the only way to stop this.



Imagesheryl
Jul 31, 2011 10:29 AM CST
Name: Sheryl
Middle Tennessee, 6b
Oy, terrible and sad.

I'm not sure the punishment quite fits the crime, but as we've said in other posts, our legal system does not address problems well.

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