Discussions and Q and A about hybridizing irises forum: Should I Keep Or Compost?

 
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ImageTBGDN
May 5, 2011 5:06 PM CST
Name: Leon
Indiana
If it ain't broke don't fix it!
I've played around with hybridizing over several years never really knowing what I was doing. But it seemed like a good hobby, so I toyed with it, always keeping in mind to expect disappointments. To date I've never come up with anything that would be worthy of registration. I remember reading some of the articles about it written by the late Robert Schreiner, Ben Hager as well as Keith Keppel, Joe Ghio, Dave Niswonger and Paul Black when he was in Oklahoma. But I've never had the space, patience, "know how", time or training to really understand what was acceptable, adequate quality, nor all the terms used by hybridizers. It was just something "fun" to do.

With this off my chest, I've kept a few seedlings around for the past two or three years that I hate to get rid of or compost. I'd like to post a few of them here as they bloom to get some feed back and expert opinions from the pros. Frankly I don't know what to expect, but I'm willing to stick my neck out to see. All comments good or bad are entirely welcome!

This one I've kept since maiden bloom in 2010. It is from Big Blue Eyes X Doozy. The central color of the falls actually shows too much blue; I can see red violet highlights in sunlight. But, I'll only post what the camera captures: NO photo shop period! It tops out at 9" with several increases on three-year rhizomes. Beards are very pale lilac/white.

Seedling SDB-2010-4 Actual Clump In The Field
Thumb of 2011-05-05/TBGDN/a6e766 Thumb of 2011-05-05/TBGDN/0705dc
I was country back when it really was.
Blog: http://garden.org/blogs/view/TBGDN/
ImageOldgardenrose
May 5, 2011 5:21 PM CST
Name: Jerry
Salem, IL
I like it. The pristine white with the solid blue is more attractive than many with washed out, muddy colors. I am a sucker for all irises having sharp, distinctly contrasting colors. Looks like a keeper.
ImagePaul2032
May 5, 2011 5:34 PM CST
Name: Paul Smith
Pleasant Grove Utah
Grandchildren are my greatest joy.
I like it also for the same reasons that Jerry gave. The contrast between the white and the rich fall spot is great. Hurray! Hurray! Hurray! I am planting some seedlings today. They are for my own curiosity and pleasure.
Paul Smith Pleasant Grove, Utah
Imageirisarian
May 5, 2011 6:01 PM CST
Name: Lucy
Hamilton, MA
irises
Lovely flower. How is the height of the stem (looks short in the picture). If that is so, keep it and perhaps cross with a Taller white which might keep the blue spot (really) since the colors are related and the fall spot is rather dominent. but that flower should not be lost. I would search your garden for a good candidate.
ImagePollyK
May 5, 2011 6:33 PM CST
Name: Polly Kinsman
Hannibal, NY

I'm not a bearded person, but I love it! I really like the distinctness of colors, as pointed out above. Very eye catching.
Imageirisloverdee
May 5, 2011 6:36 PM CST
Name: Dee Stewart
Willamette Valley OR
Snowpeak Iris
Do you have access to a judges training book?

What you need to look for if you wish to introduce it is the following straight from the JT book

MDB under 8" from ground to top of bud/blossum no more than 3" across unbranched stem earliest to bloom Dainty flower and good proportion

SDB 8 to 16" tall under 4" wide stems both branched and unbranched but with 2 or more terminal buds.

It seems to have very good form, good color contrast and similar but not the same to what I have seen out on the market.

You have done a good job and if you do not introduce it please keep and use it in the future if it follows the above. I would be happy to test here in OR if you wish.

D
Denise Stewart
541-259-2343
Snowpeak http://snowpeakiris.com

ImageTBGDN
May 5, 2011 7:25 PM CST
Name: Leon
Indiana
If it ain't broke don't fix it!
Dee, I'll take a closer look at the terminal buds. I don't have a judges' training book; might be something I could order? Also I might just send you a few rhizomes of it for testing; then you could actually "see" it instead of a picture. Also, I have a few others I want to post here -IF- they look half as good as this one.

I also have a three-year old TB seedling out of Presence X Happenstance that I'd like to get some feed-back on if it shows any promise at all. Right now I have some single rhizomes lines out, but don't know if I'll get blooms since they were re-plants last summer. Here are a couple of pictures from its maiden bloom in 2009:

Seedling TB-2009-1 Presence X Happenstance (Close-up) Also a clump shot from 2009.
Thumb of 2011-05-06/TBGDN/e2b842 Thumb of 2011-05-06/TBGDN/2216a4 Thumb of 2011-05-06/TBGDN/1af6fd

I will know more about this TB later this month when I see how (& IF) it blooms on first year re-plants. I have high hopes for it, BUT I have to be realistic: I know It has to have more than good looks. It is double-socketed with two branches and a spur. Another thing: height is about 32" with thick stems. It has a mauve influence from Presence.
I was country back when it really was.
Blog: http://garden.org/blogs/view/TBGDN/
Imageirisloverdee
May 5, 2011 8:21 PM CST
Name: Dee Stewart
Willamette Valley OR
Snowpeak Iris
the Judges training handbook helps in many ways. This is the book we use for us to consider introducing and also for shows and garden judging

You can get the book on the AIS book for I think $15.00 and it is worth every penny.

Thank you for allowing me to test it.

The TB one above, please do not take this wrong, it is lovely but unless it is an improvement to Happenstance, it looks too much like it. Now that being said does it have more buds more branching than Happenstance?

Because pink is something that people either find very appealing to them or not at all. Do not know why as I happen to be one of the ones that like them quite well.

Check the size of the bloom the bud count the branching the overall look is the bloom, the stalk and the foliage in proportion over all.

But I have almost all of Keppel pink and if I test it I can test it next to his pinks...

D




Denise Stewart
541-259-2343
Snowpeak http://snowpeakiris.com

ImagePaul2032
May 5, 2011 9:01 PM CST
Name: Paul Smith
Pleasant Grove Utah
Grandchildren are my greatest joy.
I am far from an expert but I love pinks and this one is pretty.. How is its vigor...increase? On the clump shot do I see a little lavender in the standards? This is entirely a side issue but I find pictures that are taken with a full view of the fall rather than between the falls far more attractive.
Paul Smith Pleasant Grove, Utah
Imageirisloverdee
May 5, 2011 9:07 PM CST
Name: Dee Stewart
Willamette Valley OR
Snowpeak Iris
If you look at most of my shots that I posted this year, you will see that I take it so the bud in not showing and also a full view of the fall showing the beard.

This is something I learned from a pro and Anita Moran.

D
Denise Stewart
541-259-2343
Snowpeak http://snowpeakiris.com

Imageirisarian
May 5, 2011 9:35 PM CST
Name: Lucy
Hamilton, MA
irises
Hybridizing is fun, like christmas in the spring whether you keep them or not. those plants have possiblities. You can tell the real dogs right away. Other things besides the flower, as mentioned vigor is one. For example: Happenstance doesn't like to grow in our area. You learn those things by testing & as Dee sees so many plants in her area she would be such a good place to do so.

Definately get the book from AIS. Standards get rewritten, but it shows what you should be looking for.
ImagePaul2032
May 5, 2011 10:13 PM CST
Name: Paul Smith
Pleasant Grove Utah
Grandchildren are my greatest joy.
One more comment.....to my eye Happenstance and also Guardian Angel are rich pinks with a little coral or peach in the pink. To my eye this iris looks like what we used to call a blue pink. Is that term still used or is there a better description?
Paul Smith Pleasant Grove, Utah
ImageTBGDN
May 6, 2011 8:27 AM CST
Name: Leon
Indiana
If it ain't broke don't fix it!
Thanks everyone for your input. This should always be important for "backyard" hybridizers, and it means a lot to me that you take the time to give me points to learn from. How else can we know the good points from the bad? So I take very seriously the feedback to gain some insight and just what to look for.

Lucy, Believe me I've had a few (many) "dogs" over the past several years, and I can count on four fingers the seedlings that I've kept during that time. The problem is I can't get the compost pile to rot; It just keeps sending up new growth (dogs?) each spring; and I do mean they are ugly! Pink TB's are very difficult here: Happenstance & Presence are my best along with Vanity & Vanity's Child. So yes, vigor means a lot to me in a cold Zone5. Some just like to rot no matter what the weather conditions are.

Dee I'm going to pack up three rhizomes each of the SDB & the pink TB above after blooms have stopped and send them to you at Snowpeak. Is that OK? And I do appreciate your offer to evaluate: Heaven only knows you must be busy enough with everything else going on. Yes, I will get the AIS book from their online store. I did have one picture that doesn't show the bud sticking out & I'll insert it here: But another point I wonder about is its height. It seems short for a TB.

Paul, I do appreciate your feedback. These pictures are from 2009 & I divided everything last year and did several replants; so I don't know just what to expect this year. Most of the MDB's & SDB's haven't bloomed yet: This is a very late iris season here- by at least a week or two. Yes, It definitely has some lilac/blue influence in the coloring, especially when buds first open. I am posting the only picture I have that doesn't have a bud sticking out somewhere. I would want Dee to grow this for a couple of years to get her analysis.

And I want to give all of you a BIG THANKS for taking time out to give your input! (P.S. Dee I consider you & Anita both pros Smiling !!)

Here's the only picture showing the fall without a bud.

Thumb of 2011-05-06/TBGDN/fbd050
I was country back when it really was.
Blog: http://garden.org/blogs/view/TBGDN/
ImageMShadow
May 6, 2011 9:12 AM CST
Name: Marilyn Campbell
Houghton Lake, MI
Leon, they both are beautiful!
Imageirisloverdee
May 6, 2011 9:17 AM CST
Name: Dee Stewart
Willamette Valley OR
Snowpeak Iris
Much better Leon on the picture

Height for TB anything about 27 1/2" tall. You see the IB and TB can be hard to decide...

Yes, send to Snowpeak Iris address and what I do once in bloom for 2 years, I measure overall height flower size bloom season branching buds and anything else and give you a report on my findings, better to do while in bloom then I will not forget.

Vigor is a big issue with certain colors of iris I have noticed and some from overseas take time to climate (sp) themselves...

D
Denise Stewart
541-259-2343
Snowpeak http://snowpeakiris.com

ImageBetja
May 6, 2011 9:17 AM CST
Name: Betty Jacobs
Bakersfield, CA
You've shown us that pink before, and I think it is absolutely beautiful!
Betty
Imageirisarian
May 6, 2011 10:09 AM CST
Name: Lucy
Hamilton, MA
irises
Vanity is very hardy here. It is borer prone, but so vigorous it outgrows them & for years was the favorite TB iris in New England. that was the vote of the iris people. It needs help on the foliage. Perhaps if crossed to Happenstance here, foliage problem with V. & growth problem with H. would clear up. but don't count on it.

However the view you have posted of your TB shows a very nice flower. So good of Dee to test for you.
ImagePollyK
May 6, 2011 1:23 PM CST
Name: Polly Kinsman
Hannibal, NY

Once again, not being a bearded person, I love it! I would buy it. I'm glad it's traveling to Dee to be tested. Please let us know on here if you decide to intro either of the above. .
ImageTBGDN
May 6, 2011 2:57 PM CST
Name: Leon
Indiana
If it ain't broke don't fix it!
Thanks everybody for the great input all around. If I ever decide to register it, you all will be the first to know. But first I would like Dee to give it a good evaluation at her place. I appreciate all the pros & cons. Smiling

This is Paul Black's Chubby Cheeks from this morning.
Thumb of 2011-05-06/TBGDN/4789e6
Could note resist posting.
I was country back when it really was.
Blog: http://garden.org/blogs/view/TBGDN/
Imageirisarian
May 6, 2011 7:51 PM CST
Name: Lucy
Hamilton, MA
irises
Markings are darker than they are here, or perhaps it's the light.

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