General Discussion forum: noids

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Views: 35, Replies: 37 » Jump to the end
ImagePollyK
Jun 8, 2014 6:45 AM CST
Name: Polly Kinsman
Hannibal, NY

What are your feelings about NOIDS? Do you have any in the garden? Personally I Have quite a few, but never pass them along, unless it was to my friend Kitty or Jo Ann (ge), who I know would never pass them along.

Jo Ann and I go to an iris farm, located between us, where essentially all the irises are NOIDS. He's a hybridizer, and when the irises bloom, people come from miles away to dig their own.

But I wonder how many get passed along with names.

So, what do you do with NOIDS, or are you totally against having them in your garden?


Here's a NOID from that garden, I just couldn't resist.


Thumb of 2014-06-08/PollyK/4ad7ff
ImageMuddymitts
Jun 8, 2014 7:05 AM CST
Name: Mary Ann
Kentucky
Polly -- I can see why you couldn't resist that NOID. How beautiful.

I have a small assortment of NOID's. Most of them were acquired locally, before I became obsessed with Irises, when I could just enjoy the flower. I keep them because I love them, they are identified as NOID's in my garden (tagged as NOID) and I share them with people as NOID's. One of my NOID's was recently identified. I always referred to it as NOID Lavender/Mauve. Here is May Magic:
Thumb of 2014-06-08/Muddymitts/9e724d Thumb of 2014-06-08/Muddymitts/08e23f

And here is a NOID whose identity I still do not know.
Thumb of 2014-06-08/Muddymitts/3c0d60

I will never turn down a NOID that enchants me -- but I really TRY not to be enchanted by NOID's. Big Grin
Every day is a second chance. Every day is precious time.
Imagecrowrita1
Jun 8, 2014 7:38 AM CST
Name: Arlyn
Whiteside Co, Illinois Zone 5A
I have somewhere upwards of 60 living at my house! I have 'ideas' on names for some of them, and some are in the "probably NEVER had a name group", but they are all nice plants. I really enjoy the "hunt" for a name, and never turn down a chance to add one to the garden. My only gripe with NOIDs is the folks out there in iris land, who scan the iris catalogs, picking out an iris that looks like a match to the NOID that they grow, and then forever after, use that name for their NOID....without any further research into iris itself! Even saying," It looks pretty similar to XXX", can be bad when trading an iris, because the recipient then might just drop the "pretty similar", and call it XXX! The "miss-named", and un-named iris problem has been around for years, and will continue to be a growing problem as social media sites are increasingly used as "trading posts", and amateur hybridizers pass along their un-registered creations. I really think the AIS should include, in their iris shows, a category for "Best of Show-NOID"! I realize their is a "Seedling" category, and that takes care of the Hybridizers, both amateur, and pro, but perhaps a "totally NOID section" would put some sense of "legal precedence" to having a NOID, or two, in ones garden, and help control the spread of those traveling around under an "alias"...Arlyn.
ImagePaul2032
Jun 8, 2014 9:22 AM CST
Name: Paul Smith
Pleasant Grove Utah
Grandchildren are my greatest joy.
First a trite phrase......."To each his own." I will also admit to be obsessive-compulsive. Having said this I will say I have no noids in my garden. I grow around 200 cultivars of bearded iris and know the names of 100%. All have been introduced in the last few years. I also know the names of all 75 of my roses and 200 Hostas. This is part of my enjoyment. Choices in the garden are personnel things. The first person I need to please is myself and then it is a bonus if a visitor likes my garden. I am also not into historics. The only two that I have that would qualify as historics would be Beverly Sills and Jesse's Song which look pretty modern. Again, that is a purely personnel choice. Another trite phrase...'Viva-la-difference'.....
Paul Smith Pleasant Grove, Utah
ImageMuddymitts
Jun 8, 2014 9:38 AM CST
Name: Mary Ann
Kentucky
Egg-zackly, Paul!! Big Grin
Every day is a second chance. Every day is precious time.
ImageDaveinPA
Jun 8, 2014 9:59 AM CST
Name: Dave
south central PA, Zone 6a
I tend to keep NOID's around if I like them, otherwise they are donated as NOID's or trashed. If I like the bloom then it is a totally different story! With a small property and using various edges, fence lines and such as growing space I prefer named varieties. One "rescue" from a neighbor who asked that I remove all the large clump is still taking up too much room, and I have donated over 100 of them to iris sales, but it is named, Mary Frances, a large, nice bloom. For postage anyone?
ImageUndertheSun
Jun 8, 2014 12:00 PM CST
Name: Rob
California
All the NoIDs I currently have (except for the rescued bed from my sisters vacation home) came from a local hybridizer friend (may she rest in peace) 20-30 years ago. Over the years, she gave us these irises as gifts. We would come home to find a bag of irises by our front door. These irises once had a name, but we lost those names many years ago. These irises have been neglected for many many years now and I'm slowly them bringing back to health. We are keeping these irises out of respect and in memory of our friend. I'm am thinning out the numbers, but not the different kinds.

I only started planting "named" irises last year, so my majority of irises are NoIDs. To keep them separated, the NoIDs get planted on the hill and the named in the field.
ImageMuddymitts
Jun 8, 2014 12:39 PM CST
Name: Mary Ann
Kentucky
Mary Frances is a gorgeous Iris. I already have it Dave, or I would take you up on that. I sure hope that someone does -- they'd be getting a treasure!!
Every day is a second chance. Every day is precious time.
ImagePollyK
Jun 8, 2014 6:30 PM CST
Name: Polly Kinsman
Hannibal, NY

Just what I expected to hear. Paul, I agree with you totally-to each his own, and that's why I asked the question. Arlyn. interesting response as always. Rob, sounds like you have a job ahead of you. Mary Ann, I like your outlook as usual.

Now that the irises--yours, not mine (just beginning--sibs) are winding down, let's do some more discussion on here, please.
Imagetveguy
Jun 8, 2014 7:32 PM CST
Name: Tom
Wisconsin
I do have a few NOID for sure, my infamous Red NOID, Hilarious! one that I love and will keep around of course.
Thumb of 2014-06-09/tveguy/ede2f0
Then there is this one, recieved it from a friend when I first started collecting iris before names were important.
Thumb of 2014-06-09/tveguy/bf806c
I have a few historic NOID's that I keep because they are a peice of the history of the iris, and even though I don't know their names, I know that they were steps in the develoment of what we have today.
Thumb of 2014-06-09/tveguy/d194dc
Thumb of 2014-06-09/tveguy/78c3ab
Thumb of 2014-06-09/tveguy/03480a
I have no problem passing these on to others who will like them and care for them. I always tell them if it is a NOID, and that it's best if they tell anyone who they share them with what it is. I don't feel like I have to be the gate keeper to the world of irises. There is a place in the world for the "mutt" dog, and the pedigreed one. I can love a mutt just as much as one with a pedigree. So too can I love an iris without a pedigree. If space were a big problem for me, then I would have to make my choices more carefully. But for now I can enjoy a wide variety of beauty. So I do.
ImageMuddymitts
Jun 8, 2014 10:49 PM CST
Name: Mary Ann
Kentucky
Yes. Exactly right, Tom. Some Irises are so beautiful that knowing their name is not necessary to enjoy them.

I happen to be a lucky recipient of Tom's NOID red. I appreciate it almost as much as he does. Lovey dubby Big Grin
Every day is a second chance. Every day is precious time.
ImagePollyK
Jun 9, 2014 7:25 AM CST
Name: Polly Kinsman
Hannibal, NY

So right Tom. I think we have the responsibility to keep our irises straight, and to be sure whomever we give them to, to be very explicit that they are NOIDS, but you can't be the iris world keeper.

What does everyone think the effect of patenting them will be? Will it help, or just raise the price.
Imagecrowrita1
Jun 9, 2014 8:14 AM CST
Name: Arlyn
Whiteside Co, Illinois Zone 5A
Well, that's an interesting concept! First off, I would say that the price WOULD increase! If vendor "A" hybridizes, patents, grows and sells his "Star Creation", he would have "legal rights" to that name, and that iris, as far as propagation and sales, go....but If I but the plant from him, as an individual, I can grow and pass along that plant to all my friends, and who would be the wiser? It WOULD stop vendor "B" from buying one from "A", and re- selling all the babies, I suppose, as happens a LOT now, or at least the original Hybridizer could perhaps get "royalties' on his creation, when "B" sells it. I have talked to several vendors about this issue, in respects to how they fell, and how it affects their business, when an iris is "passed along" between gardeners, or sold through "fund raising" type sales. Everyone hates to see iris vendors "go out of business" ( we are losing lots of those who grow, or grew, the older, Historic iris), but we all are willing to "share " our plants to our friends! Thus taking away their potential customers! And looking at it from the "hybridizers" viewpoint, their creation might make them some money in the first few years, maybe a lot, but probably just a little , after expenses, but then they watch their creation passed along, and possibly sold( with the profits going in someone else's pocket!), leaving them with only the "notoriety " of having created it! And your name in ( ) after the name of the iris won't put many beans on the table! The thought of patents for iris is, I'm sure, not a new one, after all, roses, and other plants, are often patented, but I think iris are much easier to "pass along" than a start from a rose....Arlyn
Imagegrannysgarden
Jun 9, 2014 11:29 AM CST
Name: Bonnie Sojourner
Harris Brake, Arkansas, zone 7
The Magnolia Zone
I do have NoIDs. I have irises that I have carried with me from home to home until I have settled here at Dunroamin. I also have named irises. I love many varieties of irises and when I see a beautiful iris I cant help but buy it. On the flip side of this I will have a friend that gifts me with her favorite iris which is a NoID and it is dear to me because it grew in her garden and because she loved it. My favorite type of bearded iris is the dwarf. The first dwarf iris I had was given to me by a dear friend that was very ill and is slipping away. I call that iris 'NoID Dorothy's Gift'. So many in this area do not care if an iris has a name or not and when they are visiting my garden and see that I have names on them they look at me as though I am a bit round the twist, so to speak. As far as finding a name for a NoID, there are some that I would like to find a name for just because they are such a grand iris. However, I cannot name them. I cannot look at a close picture and claim that name and pass it along with that name. I would be doing a disservice to the hybridizer of the named iris and to the person I gave it to. If I grow a test plant alongside and it is the same iris then I feel like I have 'found' and iris and restored its dignity.

As Paul says we all have our ideas of what we like and that is the only way gardens are different and beautiful. I respect everyone's ideas and love to see them come to fruition.

And Arlyn is right about our vendors. I visit their gardens when I can and always buy some from them. However, if that was the only way I could get my plants my iris beds would be much smaller and then the interest may be smaller. Just thoughts on a rainy day.

And one other thing, just because I have names on my irises why do people pick a bloom stalk from their grandmas garden, get in the car, arrive on my doorstep, push iris under my nose and ask me what its name is!?!?!?!?
ImageOldgardenrose
Jun 9, 2014 6:28 PM CST
Name: Jerry
Salem, IL
I am not in the same league with others on this forum, as far as numbers and types of iris, but I take the approach with any plant that it is a noid unless it comes from a commercial grower, not vendor, even though some of mine came from members who know their irises from many years of experience. Names are not important to me except for avoiding multiple purchases of the same plant.
ImagePollyK
Jun 10, 2014 7:18 AM CST
Name: Polly Kinsman
Hannibal, NY

Arlyn, I understand Scheiners has already patented, or put in for patents on some of their iris. That means there must bee money somewhere, and I don't understand what the patent prevents people from doing with the iris,Can you still use it to hybridize from?

Bonnie, very interesting thoughts on a rainy day. Raining here, too.

Jerry, names of bearded iris are not very important to me either. Sibs, of course, are, if I'm going to sell them. But since I've had this Cubit and am on ATP, I've been keeping track.
Imagelovemyhouse
Jun 10, 2014 8:29 AM CST
Name: Debra
Garland, TX (Dallas)
Service dogs: Angels with paws.
When I was collecting Daylilies, names did not become important to me until this last year or so. I just wanted as many as I could get in the colors I liked (greed is a horrible thing Sticking tongue out ). Now that I am collecting Irises with intent, I prefer named ones. However, I already had a few NOIDs that I just love and wouldn't trade, and will be getting NOIDs from some folks here that I just love, like Tom's Red (thank you, Tom Smiling ) Those will be carefully marked as NOIDS with the originator's name. Greed did overcome me a few weeks back and I got nearly 30 more NOIDs from mamajack. Those Irises I intend to keep well away from the named ones because I don't have a clue what they are as far as color, bloom time, etc. Thinking I will make a bed just for those and, when they do bloom, I will assign numbers or such to keep track. Also plan to be more careful about permanently marking the named ones than I have been with past plants so I don't end up with unintentional NOIDS. And with the Irises, I am working on grouping/planting them by complementary colors and bloom times, so knowing what they are will be important at the start.
You are free to choose. You are not, however, free from the consequences of your choice.

=========================
http://debra96.wix.com/green-amber-gardens
Imagecrowrita1
Jun 10, 2014 9:39 AM CST
Name: Arlyn
Whiteside Co, Illinois Zone 5A
I'm not really sue, either, what kinds of protection a plant patent offers, but I would guess it couldn't be sold under that name. As to use in hybridizing, I would think that would fall outside the patent restrictions, as the "baby" WOULDN'T have the same name as the parent plant, but that's just a guess. Sad state of affairs when the lawyers get involved in our gardening !! Although, as I said earlier, I can understand the originators desire to be able to get the maximum financial benefit from their work. Unless the "iris lawyers" have their own "iris police", the patent process won't impede the "pass-a-long "iris trades....who would know?...and what could they do about it? ....Arlyn
Imagegrannysgarden
Jun 10, 2014 10:27 AM CST
Name: Bonnie Sojourner
Harris Brake, Arkansas, zone 7
The Magnolia Zone
One can patent anything but ownership of a product makes it possible for me to do anything I want to do with it. If I hybridize from a patented product and make it known that I have used the patented plant in the process then I may owe a royalty to the plant parent patent owner if the patent is so written. However, as an owner of the product I can sell, give, destroy or do as I please with my property...... just sayin'.......

ImageUndertheSun
Jun 10, 2014 11:31 AM CST
Name: Rob
California
crowrita1 wrote:I'm not really sue
....Arlyn


Blinking Blinking

I'm sure Sue will be happy to know this. Sticking tongue out

I couldn't resist... Rolling on the floor laughing



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